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	<title>Comments on: The ethics of Turnitin, or How I Learned To Stop Detecting Plagiarism</title>
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	<link>http://teleogistic.net/2009/09/the-ethics-of-turnitin-or-how-i-learned-to-stop-detecting-plagiarism/</link>
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		<title>By: Boone</title>
		<link>http://teleogistic.net/2009/09/the-ethics-of-turnitin-or-how-i-learned-to-stop-detecting-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3125</link>
		<dc:creator>Boone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:51:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://teleogistic.net/?p=253#comment-3125</guid>
		<description>@Kyle - You and me both.

@Matt - Thanks for the link. In the post I really just assumed that there were real issues related to the relinquishment of ownership. It&#039;s nice to see some real evidence that this is indeed the case. From my point of view, the case against Turnitin is strong even without these legal issues, but they certainly don&#039;t hurt the case.

@Julian - That&#039;s a very interesting way to reframe the use of Turnitin. I think I agree that using Turnitin to teach about plagiarism is better than using it to &quot;catch&quot; cheaters. Aside from the intellectual property issues, I would feel relatively comfortable using Turnitin like this. I wouldn&#039;t want to rely on it too much, though. Turnitin will likely do a pretty good job identifying flat out copy-and-pasting, but my students usually need guidance with more subtle forms of citation than they do with straightforward copying. Again, it goes back to the point that the kinds of plagiarism that are arguably the most important to discuss with our students are those that Turnitin will probably be worst at detecting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Kyle &#8211; You and me both.</p>
<p>@Matt &#8211; Thanks for the link. In the post I really just assumed that there were real issues related to the relinquishment of ownership. It&#8217;s nice to see some real evidence that this is indeed the case. From my point of view, the case against Turnitin is strong even without these legal issues, but they certainly don&#8217;t hurt the case.</p>
<p>@Julian &#8211; That&#8217;s a very interesting way to reframe the use of Turnitin. I think I agree that using Turnitin to teach about plagiarism is better than using it to &#8220;catch&#8221; cheaters. Aside from the intellectual property issues, I would feel relatively comfortable using Turnitin like this. I wouldn&#8217;t want to rely on it too much, though. Turnitin will likely do a pretty good job identifying flat out copy-and-pasting, but my students usually need guidance with more subtle forms of citation than they do with straightforward copying. Again, it goes back to the point that the kinds of plagiarism that are arguably the most important to discuss with our students are those that Turnitin will probably be worst at detecting.</p>
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		<title>By: Julian Beckton</title>
		<link>http://teleogistic.net/2009/09/the-ethics-of-turnitin-or-how-i-learned-to-stop-detecting-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3113</link>
		<dc:creator>Julian Beckton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Sep 2009 11:49:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://teleogistic.net/?p=253#comment-3113</guid>
		<description>Yes, absolutely. I am sure that a great many cases of &quot;plagiarism&quot; can be traced to poor assignment setting. I also think Turnitin shot themselves in the foot when they described their product  as a &quot;detection service&quot;. Given that the  entire academic enterprise is based on using and interpreting other peoples ideas, and that we do need to acknowledge those people&#039;s work, I&#039;ve worked really hard to try to convince colleagues that Turnitin is better used to teach students about what we mean by plagiarism, (and why referencing is important) than to &quot;catch them at it&quot;!  You can use an originality report on a low or no stakes assignment early in a students career as the basis of a good discussion of the issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, absolutely. I am sure that a great many cases of &#8220;plagiarism&#8221; can be traced to poor assignment setting. I also think Turnitin shot themselves in the foot when they described their product  as a &#8220;detection service&#8221;. Given that the  entire academic enterprise is based on using and interpreting other peoples ideas, and that we do need to acknowledge those people&#8217;s work, I&#8217;ve worked really hard to try to convince colleagues that Turnitin is better used to teach students about what we mean by plagiarism, (and why referencing is important) than to &#8220;catch them at it&#8221;!  You can use an originality report on a low or no stakes assignment early in a students career as the basis of a good discussion of the issue.</p>
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		<title>By: Matt Thomas</title>
		<link>http://teleogistic.net/2009/09/the-ethics-of-turnitin-or-how-i-learned-to-stop-detecting-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3108</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt Thomas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Sep 2009 01:49:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://teleogistic.net/?p=253#comment-3108</guid>
		<description>I share your concerns about Turnitin. In my experience, the more original and specific the assignment, the harder it is for students to pass off other people&#039;s work as their own. Years-old, generic assignments are responsible for just as much plagiarism as Google + &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cut,_copy,_and_paste&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;cut, copy, and paste&lt;/a&gt;. Also, Stephen Sharon (aka &lt;a href=&quot;http://twitter.com/SSharon27&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;@SSharon27&lt;/a&gt;) caught wind of our conversation on Twitter and pointed me to a piece he wrote entitled &lt;a href=&quot;http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1396725&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&quot;Do Students Turn Over Their Rights When They Turn in Their Papers? A Case Study of Turnitin.com&quot;&lt;/a&gt; that&#039;s very much worth a read. Note the dammning conclusion it reaches.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I share your concerns about Turnitin. In my experience, the more original and specific the assignment, the harder it is for students to pass off other people&#8217;s work as their own. Years-old, generic assignments are responsible for just as much plagiarism as Google + <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cut,_copy,_and_paste" rel="nofollow">cut, copy, and paste</a>. Also, Stephen Sharon (aka <a href="http://twitter.com/SSharon27" rel="nofollow">@SSharon27</a>) caught wind of our conversation on Twitter and pointed me to a piece he wrote entitled <a href="http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1396725" rel="nofollow">&#8220;Do Students Turn Over Their Rights When They Turn in Their Papers? A Case Study of Turnitin.com&#8221;</a> that&#8217;s very much worth a read. Note the dammning conclusion it reaches.</p>
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		<title>By: Kyle Mathews</title>
		<link>http://teleogistic.net/2009/09/the-ethics-of-turnitin-or-how-i-learned-to-stop-detecting-plagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-3100</link>
		<dc:creator>Kyle Mathews</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Sep 2009 16:21:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://teleogistic.net/?p=253#comment-3100</guid>
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Loved this line:</p>
<blockquote><p>
Requiring a paper on Aristotle has negative effects on students – it takes away from the time and energy they could be spending on other things that are valuable to them – and it’s my responsibility to ensure that these negative effects are outweighed by the benefits bestowed by such an assignment. A well thought-out term paper assignment will, in the long run, have positive utility for the student.
</p></blockquote>
<p>Wish more of my teachers had considered that responsibility as carefully.</p>
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